**Please all women interested in this Jacket please try it on with your liner of choice before you buy it. The collar could be an issue regarding how tight it will feel around your neck. TRY THIS suit on in general before BUYING! It will be in your BEST interest…trust me!**
Let me preference this review by saying I am just your average run of the mill female ADV rider and all my reviews are honest based on WHAT I believe and hope they are useful somehow. Had to get that out because I get many emails from folks criticizing I am not an expert…no kidding…i know that and completely aware. 😉 Now, on to my initial review.
Today I will review the Jacket and for tomorrow I will review the pants. PICS are all clickable for larger versions
**Remember to support your dealers who sell KLIM. Not everyone does. My dealer Pacific Motosports does, and for all you online buyers again shop Revzilla through this blog…great online company. Tons a great companies and more seem to carrying the great line of KLIM products.
I took the suit out on a 200 KM trip on March 14th 2014. We just got heavy rains all night long but the skies parted and it turned out to be a beautiful Spring like day, even a little warm. I am going to post pictures, however embarrassing they are of me in my base normal gear I wear most days when riding and selfies of me in the suit. I did not have a helper so so of the pics are less than stellar.
I am not a fat grrl, but lack a defined waist, have a small chest, normal shoulders and am wide at the hips. I am almost 5’5″ with a 30.5 inseam. I am showing this pic and giving you a hint of my sizing. In jeans I wear a 14 but they are baggy…and in jackets I can usually get away with a Medium or Large in female sizing.
My usually base is simply LDComfort or LL Bean. The only other layer I would add would be a Gerbings heater liner. The Altitude comes with D3O armour which I always take out the hip pads no matter what. Why? Just because I don’t like hips pads. These are not bad and do not make you look too much wider than you are but needless to say they are out and will stay out. Armour stays really flexible when it heats up to your body temp.
Leave the suit outside in the cold garage and it can feel like a rock but not as bad as the older D3O. Up in Alaska we cracked a spine D3O pad after being out in the freezing cold. I was told this new version that would never happen.
- D3O EVO elbow armor
- D3O EVO shoulder armor
- D3O FLO 1 back protector (level 1)
Let’s start with the Jacket-this is where I think KLIM could make some adjustments in their future generation releases. I swore to myself I would never buy a Klim first generation anything because they do listen to real rider reviews and often eventual changes. I hope if enough of us grrls out there agree on some mods to make the jacket less stereotyped, then perhaps I would have to buy again..
So, who am I to tell KLIM R&D they need to make changes all ready with their jacket…I am me who always has an opinion and would love this gear to fit more grrls on ADV bikes than less and more comfortably.
The Altitude jacket is made just as well as the mens Misano Latitude, Same Misano material and KLIM uses 840 Cordura in the high impact zones. The suit feels much heavier than my Traverse I got in 2010 but to be expected this is a more technical piece of gear. So, let’s get to the point of reviewing this jacket and start with the Fancy features and sizing.
The Klim Altitude is a true woman’s fully functional feature-rich jacket tailored to fit the female form promises to break new ground in women’s motorcycle apparel. From concept to completion, this garment was specifically designed to fit and was based on the comments of hundreds of women riders.
- Gore-Tex Misano performance fabric (Guaranteed TO KEEP YOU DRY)
- 840D high tenacity nylon abrasion zones at elbow shoulder and lower rear hem
- Two bicep vents
- Pit zips vents
- 2 vertical back vents
- Adjustable side gussets at waist expands hip circumference 6″
- Collar to shoulder fasteners for when an open collar is needed
- Single adjuster on forearms
- External waist belt
- 3M Scotchlight reflective for increased visibility in dark conditions (Reflects light back to its source such as as vehicle headlights, making the rider visible to motorists more esier and earlier)
- External pockets – two lower hand pockets, two large horizontal chest pockets
- STAT Tag pocket on the lower left arm ( Holds an Emergency Contact and medical condition card, you need to register to get the card)
- Velcro wrist tab closures
- Jacket to pant zipper panel
- Functional and fashionable
- Specifically designed for women riders
- Special sizing specifically for women
- Internal pockets – two upper zippered mesh pockets, two lower velcro closure mesh pockets, and one hidden passport / money pocket
- Micro fleece lined collar
SIZING – The cut of the Altitude Jacket I would say is ideally made for the grrl who has a distinct waist line, who is lean through the gut and not too broad in the shoulders. I was would say the cut is still American versus European but the way it fits me the chest and shoulders is a bit restricted. I ordered a LARGE based on the size chart and would not go up to an extra large. Bottom line this jacket is more tailored than I thought it would be. I believe with the waist adjustment and arm straps, perhaps the R&D at KLIM could think of making the cut a bit more boxy, more room around the gut, shoulders and chest and allow the rider to synch the waist to give shape and adjust the hip gators as well.
When riding the bike I opened the hip gators and used the two way zipper to make the jacket feel more relaxed. It helped but I could still feel some tightness across the chest area. Also, the jacket does bunch while sitting on the bike in the chest and shoulder area as well. This is common for me with KLIM suits. I have worn and own the Traverse since 2010, tried the first generation Latitude when it came out and all the jackets tend to do this on me.
The collar. Like the height, does not interfere with my helmet. I am going to have to get more coordinated to line up the snaps and try to get them secure. Seems like a no brainer but I initially found this to take a lot of time but I think I am getting quicker. 😉 My issue with the collar is when I put on my Gerbing Heater liner zippers all the way up for warmth, it makes the Altitude collar pretty tight and hard to snap close. As a matter of fact I was unable to get the snaps closed at all. Because the jacket is quit fitted on me adding that extra liner could pose a comfort issues.
I will try it out while riding. I didn’t have to wear a liner yesterday. This jacket on me feels less like a Gore Tex Shell and more like a fitted jacket.
The above pic shows how you can open the collar and secure it open so no flapping. Use the snaps on the shoulders and you are able to secure the collar. Again I would have just used the Rev it style hook, or maybe would have just rolled back to the on itself with a snap. This set up works but why reinvent some wheels? If you have the collar open, my helmet strap got caught quite a few times on the velcro. Something to be mindful when I decide not to completely zipper up.
Nice to get a jacket all ready equipped with great armour especially the spine. Many high quality jackets still send them out with FOAM making the owner have to upgrade. Sending a jacket out that costs $$ with a cheap piece of crap foam protector seems insulting to me. 😉
Good view of the side hip extensions. I like this idea and would have loved to see this concept on the KLIM Overland suit. I was thinking of buying that suit but would still be forced to wear a men’s large jacket and would float in it like my Traverse. I need larger guy sizing because of my hips.
Collar secure and all suited up. I actually love the 3M highlights and as for the colour? Yes it’s light, will show dirt but these suits are easy to care for…Machine Wash warm, rinse well, tumble dry medium unit completely dry. The PITA part is taking out the armour. These suits when they get dirty and/or dusty can lose some of it’s waterproofness. When I am on trips sometimes I use a hose to at least get the dust off when I can’t find a laundry machine.
Close up of waist adjusters and forearm. Simple to use pull and secure to the Velcro and you are done. Having the ability to adjust the suit somewhat is good. I made the jacket fit with absolutely no flapping away in the wind, no loose ends. You can use the straps the cover the zipper pulls too. Nothing more annoying that a zipper pull flying around in your eye sight too.
Back view not so flattering. Like I said I have hips and my father’s wide girth and the suit does not make that any better but I am not really into looking like a fashion plate. Here you see the rear exhaust vents on both the jacket and pants. Will review the pants tomorrow. Again lot’s of 3M reflective tape, the embroidered KLIM name also reflects. KLIM was very tasteful where they placed their name and how they used their logo on this suit.
The least flattering view is the side. Again I am not skinny at all, athletic build but here I think because the jacket fits snug around my chest it appears I have a beer gut and little to no shape. I will hit the treadmill more! 😉 In any case, good way to see the zippers, how they used the orange to highlight pockets and vents. I really LOVE the orange! I think the vents will works well and there is no doubt I will use this suit in the Summer and all seasons. Inside one of the chest pockets i found what looks like a waterproof fabric case. Maybe to use for your phone? Not sure but did not take a picture of it. Those of you who buy check it out.
Jacket has decent hand pockets which I use all the time, the pants not so much. Pants have 2 little “hand” pockets that are shallow too. I will review the pants later but I miss the cargo pocket I have on the Traverse pants and if adding hand pockets on pants I would make them more useful than not.
Out in the wild. Suit is now USED and mine to keep. I am psyched that KLIM has produced a suit made from equal material as the guys, a waterproof shell that keeps the outside and inside dry…a suit with technically placed vents and pockets inside and out. I think this validates that we as women adventure riders are being taken more seriously. I know we are what? Less than 10% of the riders out there so KLIM is taking a chance to produce a costly suit for how many of us???
My opinion is this…If you value your body, want to ride, make sure you have enough money at the end of the day to spend on GREAT gear versus OK gear. KLIM has always kept me dry, no need to stop to add rain liner etc. To me it’s worth the price and also how serious they take their motor sports and customers.
QUESTIONS? COMMENTS? Feel free to post away. I hope some made it down to this part of the post. I will probably edit this post as I remember more things but for now this is my 1st Impression of the jacket. I will take this on my cross-country solo trip coming up in May. Oh, would I recommend this jacket? If you are leaner than me, have a smaller waist and are not overly large in the bust area you will love this jacket.
I will learn to adjust but my body type up top is really on the fence when it comes to HIGHLY recommending this based on fit alone. The quality and thought that went into this suit is impeccable. If I find after my month-long trip it’s not what I thought I might get the Latitude Misano in a men’s medium. Oh, but I do LOVE the Orange on this jacket and I am being serious! 😉
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Advgrrl Motorcycle Adventures & More 
Thanks for the review. Definitely still going to need to go to a dealer and try this stuff on first before my wife buys.
I had the light grey original Latitude that was the full 840 and it does get dirty quick. Tip on removing and replacing armour, make a diagram and then write a “this way up” and “this way in” instructions on the armour with a sharpie. That way you can replace it with the suit inside out.
The reason I went with the light grey was to not absorb heat. I found in the end that it performed well in the heat as long as you were moving. The latitude was also well vented and it looks like this one will perform about the same although the lighter Misano material may make it feel lighter and hence cooler.
good tip on the armour and yes, try it on before you buy….
Not an expert, Ehhh…well I disagree with that assumption by some of your readers. I ask them…how does one quantify expert, anyway? Do you need to win races? yes, that’s one way to become an expert. You can go to design-engineering school and then create great riding gear for the masses? yes that is another way. You can also log tens of thousands of miles on a big-bore-adv-moto, taking it on nearly every type of surface and through all types of weather? Absolutely!
Worldly experience during long distance riding cements your ADV credentials, especially when you are part of the 10% of the riding population and even more so when you are piloting and not in the pinion position! We, you and I, ride the same bike F800GS, I am 5’9″ with a 35″ inseam, I am still a little edgy on certain terrains; I admire your abilities in managing this bike! Moreover, you have continually pushed to learn more about ADV-riding, pushed your skills with new challenges and testing new clothing designs by pushing your tin-n-togs (bike and gear) way way past the post office and super market ‘poser rides’ which is the core experience of many riders out there; while calling themselves ADV riders. Don’t sell yourself or your riding experience and history, short!
Your blog and its transparency into your riding and personal life cements your expertise for this reader. I have been keeping up with you online for a while now and from what I see, you have logged way more miles than most of the riders I know, in person and online. Your blog and reviews are frank, fresh, and straight forward, created from actually using the gear past a few spins around the block in pizzy weather to quantify its hydro non-abilities.
After reading the KLIM piece, I am more confident than ever (I ride the Badlands Pro setup) its the right set-up for my wife, now I just have to convince her about spending the money…so, keep the wheels and keyboard rolling, your on the right path and I hope more people find your blog and reviews as helpful as I have. Oh, one last thing, we all look frumpy and odd to non-riders in our ADV gear, to ADV riders we look sexy as hell, no matter the shape! A funny side note on riding in KLIM gear and looks…I live in Maine and when I pull in for fuel during the summer months, someone usually points one of three things to me. 1- hey buddy, its not Halloween so put away the snowmobile suit (yuk yuk). 2- Where’s yer sled??? (yuk yuk). 3- Hey BUDDY, go back to Mass, no snow up here this time of year (yuk yuk) I always smile and nod (I’m usually absorbed in some cool spirited music flowing in my XD4’s headset) as I casually dribble the last few drops of fuel on their greasy work boots…up in the North Wood, KLIM’s only recognition is for sled (snowmobile) riding..on the rare occasion I do get a compliment or two, especially from elderly folks who LOVE the neon yellow they can see from a mile away, even in the rain.
Thanks for your kind words and appreciation.
Leslie, I think this was a great review, but I wondered, did you buy the gear or was KLIM willing to give it to you in exchange for your review? For gear that costs as much as KLIM, I am curious.
My biggest concern on this new suit is about your having to send back the jacket for a larger size, but not the pants. Seems the jacket should not be THAT much too small and the pants THAT much too big. I also don’t like my helmet strap getting caught on velcro or anything else on my jacket. Lastly, I do agree it is nice to have the full armor package on gear that costs this much. I wish they would offer women’s gear in neon yellow, not just the gray/orange. I want to be seen! Our BMW dealer here said they would not order any women’s KLIM gear because the higher priced gear they already have for women is just sitting there, and they have to discount it sharply to get rid of it. That is disappointing, because try before you buy will not be possible. I told them that I would then have to give my business to a dealer in another area that IS willing to have some in store. Anyway, thanks for the thorough review. Going to read the pants review now.
I bought the gear and in no way do I have to review it swaying one direction or the other. I would wait on buying the jacket. I’ve been in touch with the head marketing guy about my concerns about the fit and now the collar width for sure with a liner. This jacket will fit some girls but not enough for the $.
I’m sending my jacket back and will be using the guys latitude Misano jacket for my trip. I would not be able to be comfortable using my heated liner at all with the way the jacket is set up. I became very aware of the collar issue this morning riding to work.
Sorry, by my question I didn’t mean to imply that you wouldn’t give your honest opinions on the product! I was really just curious how interested KLIM was in getting solid women’s riding feedback…apparently not interested enough to hand some out.
I agree with your comments on buying the womens jacket now. I added a comment on the pants review about the Latitude,,,I liked it very much. I will have the opportunity (I hope) to try both at a dealer in the next state over at the end of the month. I will come back and share my fit experience if they have it in stock.
Sounds good and Klim and I do have a relationship because I ride a lot they are nice to me but I remain honest
Hi Leslie, I just wanted to follow up on the sizing thing now that I have had a chance to try on the Altitude. I mentioned that our local dealer was not willing to carry the new women’s line of KLIM because they have too many unsold women’s pieces in several other lines. So, on a trip this past weekend, we went to Eurosport BMW in Asheville, NC. They had a good selection and I was able to try the jacket. Over the last year, I lost 20 pounds, and now consistently wear a women’s Large in First Gear & Olympia and a 44 in RevIT. The large Altitude fit perfect, over my heated liner jacket. I didn’t even try the pants due to the REALLY low cut front and the baggy bottom. All that said, I think my next winter jacket will be a Men’s Latitude, in neon yellow. It fit me like it was made for me, again, with my heated liner on. I currently wear a First Gear TPG pant that I LOVE. Not sure what I am going to do when they are worn out, since I don’t think FG is making them anymore. Anyway, my two cents.
And I did see on FB that you are losing weight too and now have a Large, congrats on that! BTW, I do agree the neck needs at least one adjustment factor.
The pants rock. The low front high back you get used to. The baggy butt is great for comfort in the riding position. The collar for me not ideal but rode with it not snapped in pouring rain. Just used the Velcro and stayed 100% dry. Love how Klim has figured out how to keep your crotch dry too lol
Leslie, it is fabulous to hear you tested in the rain already! I agree, it is a feat to keep the crotch dry. Maybe the Altitude pants will be a choice for me one day when my FG wear out. 🙂
Hi Leslie,
I just got home with my new Altitude jacket! I ended up with the small as the medium was just too long. I’m 5’03” about 125 lbs. I like the hip gussets open. The material is a bit stiff but I’m sure it will break in very soon. The chest does seem a bit restrictive but, once I got onto the bike and had my arms on the handlebars of my GS, the tightness disappeared. The fit is similar to my Vanson jacket in the chest. I rode it home over the mountain pass at about 10 pm from the shop and my husband was constantly commenting on how bright it was with the retro-reflectivity…he always rides behind me while complaining that I am a speed-racer, silly boy 😉
The pants are on back order from KLIM so I’m not sure what size I’ll need. Based on your review of them running large, I’m guessing I’ll need a 4 or 6. They said it might take a month or more. I hope not…
The jacket was warm and comfortable through the 50 degree night with no extra layers. The KLIM rep was at the shop and he says the company guarantees their water-proof condition for 10 years. I’m really looking forward to that! I hate being wet on a ride but I don’t mind riding in the rain. This should make life much more pleasant.
Thanks for your write-up on the suit. It helped me figure out the idiosyncrasies of the jacket and what to expect from the pants.
Ride safe,
Colleen
awesome…I still believe grrls my size will have jacket issues but you are the perfect size to fit the cut. I have the 12 pants and went to an extra large jacket to fit my liner with the collar snapped closed, Might get a large as well as I am losing weight. Enjoy your new suit and good to know it;s defective to be seen.
It is a frustrating situation, fitting of expensive gear to ones body. I managed ski shops for a number of years, certified tech and boot fitter, as well as doing my time in the textile section. It was heart breaking at times to witness the personal realization that the body didn’t match up to the gender. Girly-girls were the worst and had the most difficult time adjusting to the concept of imagined size versus measured size. Boots were hard as well.
Feet are feet and ankles are ankles, but body mass-weight throws off the gender norms that boots are designed around. At a point in a woman’s boot design, their weight trumps the design and construction. Faced with the dilemma of pointing out the obvious and possibly losing the customer, I devised a few ways to navigate the area of asking how much does someone weigh. Also, muscle mass versus chub throws off the fitment too; muscle weights more than fat, and some body builders get pretty upset with our recommendations based on their weight factor.
Boot fitting was the easiest, it either supported the persons mass or not and as far as comfort, too many variables to explain in a short post; seven different manufacturers mean, seven different fits…something would eventually feel good and take the weight; sometimes fitting into the opposite gender was the final solution. Boots fitting is simple physics: if your body weight is over 170 you are pushing past the limitations of many ladies boots. If you are under 125lb, you are too light for the softest flex in mens boot (generally speaking).
To the clothing end of the customer, taking measurements and directing traffic became and art in diplomacy and education, a career-long challenge. So, I devised and used a match up system; especially helping fit women. I would carefully compare them to my own body size; 5’9″ 145-150 lbs. This also meant looking closely as possible, without being creepy, at bone structure, bust size, and hips. The closer the women to my size, the closer to fitting men’s sizes they were. The tale of the tape does not lie! The basic measurements create a framework to run with; wrist to collar, chest, inseam, and hips (measured at the hips nut up around a sucked in tummy), and the collarbone to the hip bone. What they perceived, prior to attempting to buy snows sport clothes, was usually off by a long shot. Especially when they referred to their #size; 2, 4, 6, 14 etc. Actual weight versus real weight, another fiction based response.
You would not believe, well maybe you do, how people LIE! When asked, hardly anyone would give me (us-the shop) the correct measurements, ever! 6’s were 4’s, 2’s were 0’s and so on. To avoid the obvious social difficulties and expense (shop time) with debating with the customer about their physique, we went straight to the tape; identical to the practices of a quality suit fitter. Training staff to be consistent and careful with customers was pretty easy, and a side effect was the impression of professionalism. In the six years as a store manager, I never had an issue taking customers measurements to help them get into the right gear. When it came to weight, we used a modified bathroom scale, a blind scale, the color coded dial told us their weight but did not show actual pounds. Once size established, the customer outside the norms had to make decisions on style-company-gender to actual fit.
Getting women to cross the isle to shop the mens section was nearly impossible. Consequently, the search for ski clothing with fit the gals who were outside the norms for their gender became a project. Eventually we did source and organize specific venders that had a wider choice in size: Columbia being one of them (at the time). More times than not, the department which saved our sale and created a satisfied customer had the snowboard and free-ride clothing lines! Baggy and colorful, full of technical materials, nearly anyone can fit into these lines and look great. Complements go out to 686, Burton, and Obermeyer as some of the leading companies making good stuff for larger people!
Now, a question I have always pondered about my discoveries in the ski industry. The higher the price the small the figure! Few of the high-end clothing companies had sizes which I could wear, and I am average size for a man, large for a woman. The lower priced lines had the big stuff! This became obvious to me while working in the ski industry that certain companies such as Bogner, NILS, and Gucci (yes, they make ski clothes to). It became apparent that these companies wanted their product on specific body sizes, athletic to thin. Who would want a chubster clowning around in your $1800.00 ski jacket. I suspect this is true in the world of high end fashion, but lack the depth of knowledge in that industry; nor do I have the time or patience to research it.
I am interested in the KLIM line and if they practice a leaner-size control of their products, censorship is what I call it, and don’t want their goods on bigger than average sized women? It was clear to us that nearly all of the European companies discriminated against larger sizes by not making them: I believe the largest size in the Nils line is a 14 (USA). European companies make it nearly impossible for bigger ladies to fit into their products, while Mens lines are much more generous in range. Finding the right fit begins with taking the right line of approach to what appeals and what will actually work. While I love the higher end brands, at times I have some issues with their obvious narrow marketing to specific body type. From this, one could also assume (I know, leave the ASSuME out of the comments section) that skinny people are wealthier and high end companies have their backs, literally. Or so it might seem.
Best way to ensure a great fit and finding the right company is to do some homework and be honest with measurements and actual body type. Figure out early how close to the norm for your gender you are, then look into companies which create products you can live with. It appears to me, from Leslie;s fitment experiment, that KLIM had narrowed their ladies line to fit a specific size range while their mens line is way more generous in range! One of my happiest customers was a jokey from the Miami racing circuit with a penchant for skiing. Fitted in a pair of Nordica Ladies boots, his world was lit on fire from proper fitting and flexing boots for his near 100lb 4’10 body! Another, was a 300lb aircraft recovery agent in Tucson Az that needed an extra plastic layer added under the tongue of his Atomic boots to provide the correct support. Lastly, the heavier than average woman, a ranking member of the Palm Beach areas wealthier community, who I got to transition from over-tight Bogner one piece ski suits to 686 Freeride gear…I got a ton of appreciation and tip for that one!
I am sorry to read that KLIM had apparently taken a narrow approach to their female customer base and I would bet that they ave few women on their design or executive team!!
Mark
I am a very experienced female skier that, despite being fairly sporty, am by no means small. I generally buy men’s ski clothing (or unisex as more tactful sales staff describe it) and have custom injection moulded ski boots for the same reasons you mention above. I am a recent convert to riding, having passed my test only 6 months ago and bought an F650GS. I have spent the last month trying to find a bike suit that fits properly for my tour from the north of Scotland to the south of Spain planned for the end of May, and have suffered the embarrassment and humiliation of UK stockists having barely any choice of ladies’ gear and those who do generally only stock to a UK 14 (US 10!) when I am a 5’8″ size 18/20 (US 14/16). I have tried men’s suits but find the arms and legs too long and, as Leslie notes above, the hips are usually a problem, with jackets too tight on the hips and trousers too loose on the waist. However, I saw an advert for the Klim ladies Altitude suit and a bit of internet searching indicated that the largest size would fit so I found my nearest stockist, who were absolutely brilliant and ordered in a suit for me to try in my size. I visited today and was delighted. It is the first suit that has really fit properly, and again as Leslie mentions, has the same quality of material and armour as men’s gear. I could probably have gone a size smaller in the jacket (I bought 2XL jacket) but decided not to so that I can fit warm layers underneath as winter riding in Scotland can get a bit chilly….! The trousers are a great fit (US16) fitted on the (adjustable) waist and hips, but not too tight around thighs and bum. So, in my opinion, Klim have delivered a suit in more generous ladies sizes. It is certainly better than any other company I have tried in the past 4 weeks which includes BMW, Richa, Rukka, RST and Dainese.
I found this blog through a search for reviews to check that my instincts were right and find Leslie’s fair review to validate my own, far less experienced, opinion. Thank you Leslie; you really seem to know what you are talking about so I will be following your blog from now on with interest. Unfortunately I am 600 miles away from my bike at the moment so I now have to wait 2 weeks before I can properly test the suit. I hope the time goes by quickly…!
great review yourself and have fun on the F650…you got the twin? I really like this suit especially the pants…word of advise zip up the jacket side pockets in the rain…mine got wet and took awhile to dry out..thanks for finding my blog and your insightful comment.
Yes, it is the twin. My legs are a bit short so once I get a bit more experience on the 650 with low seat I will hopefully move up a size to the 800 and just have one foot on the ground most of the time.
Thanks for the tip about the pockets. I imagine wet gear whilst on a tour can be miserable!
Good news even with pockets open you stay dry inside . Have fun with the twin and snatchy throttle lol love BMW twin engines lol